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Seeker

A case for Ibadi Islam(?)

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Seeker    113

(Specifically pinging those who live in the Middle East (hello @Saddam ) and those who don't, but know about the religion as a whole from experience (hello @Viiolai ) Other people are welcome to join the discussion too, if they're interested.)

 

Islam gets a lot of bad rep and I'd say it's mostly justified, but often misguided. Strawmanning from both sides are so frequent and it sucks, because the discussion isn't going anywhere. No, not all Muslims are terrorists (far from it) but yes, the vast majority of religious terrorists in this day and age are Muslims (Sunni Muslims, specifically.)

 

As I see it, the three main problems with Islam are taqiya, the need for a Caliphate and persecution of infidels. The two people tagged, please correct me if I'm wrong on these things, but I'd say Ibadi is actually a fantastic school of Islam, in that case.

Regarding taqiya, the Ibadi version is the less exploitable kitman, which isn't a Qur'anic 'get out of jail free' card used when you need to lie or conceal things about the religion, but rather allows silence or lying by omission only.

Uniquely Ibadi is also that a Caliphate isn't a necessity and that it's better to let each Islamic country govern itself, until a single leader deemed fit for the job is found. They also don't think it's necessary for such a Caliph to have descended from the tribe of Muhammad.

Last but not least is how they treat non-Muslims. In this regard, Oman (the only Ibadi-majority country) is one of the best, perhaps even the best Islamic country. Sure, it's no Israel and there are definitely areas that need work (Christians for example, are tolerated but building a Church might give you a hard time.)

 

Ibadi discussion in general, I guess? I'm quite intrigued by such a benign(-ish) take on a religion that I consider vile in a lot of ways.

 

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ragreynolds    753

I think a large problem with Islam is that it is not just a religion like Christianity or Judaism, but rather it is largely political. But really, I think the main issue with Islam compared to other religions can be seen when you look at the main figure throughout the holy texts. I hate to compare Islam to Christianity, but when you look at Jesus Christ, who Christians look to as their prime example of a great human being, what you have is a peaceful carpenter who was adamantly against war and harming other human beings. You can say whatever you want about the Christian God and how he was cruel and nasty, but when you look at Jesus Christ, the man Christians idolise, you will only find good. On the flip side, look at Muhammad, the man Muslims idolise. Muhammad was not a man of peace, he was not a nice man. Muhammad was a warlord who had a child wife. Muhammad called for his followers to kill or convert every non-Muslim.

I've heard people say things like "Islam is the only major religion never to go through the enlightenment", and to an extent, I've always agreed with that. However, when your holy book specifically instructs its followers to kill or convert all non-believers, or when the main man of your religion is a pedophile warlord... I don't think there's really much to work with. Yes, the Bible says lots of vile things. The Bible condemns homosexuality, but nowhere in the Bible does it say that gay people should be killed. Yes, the Bible says that if you don't believe in the Christian God, then you will go to hell. But nowhere in the Bible does it say that nonbelievers should be either killed or converted. Whereas in the Quran, it doesn't just say that not believing in the Islamic God is a sin. It also instructs Muslims to kill or convert those who do not follow it. There are tremendous differences between these two books. You have one that says certain things are bad, whereas you have another that directly instructs people to do horrible things about those things that are deemed as bad.

Now, what I've mentioned are obviously just general things in regards to the whole of Islam. I'm personally not familiar with Ibadi and what the difference there is, so I do look forward to seeing what other people say about it in this thread.

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Viiolai    212

@Seeker

Thanks for thinking of me, but I've never studied Islam other than in basic RE classes at school and my parents have never really been strict with it, my dad doesn't eat pork but that's about it :lol: 

I would join in on the discussion anyways but I don't even understand half the terminology you've used either!

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